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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ran across this on another forum, copy/paste below:

The event currently has a permit from BLM. Grand County(Moab) has denied a permit for the event citing noise complaints(exhausts/stereos).

Event organizers had tried to move the main event to San Juan County. Today SJC denied a permit for the event. Grand County officials put a lot of pressure on SJC officials.

At this point the formal event is up in the wind.

Bottom line: Grand County officials HATE UTV's. If you visit Moab, be a good steward on the streets, and spend your money wisely.

 

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I watched the video. It would be nice if Kawasaki offered turn signals and a horn to help it stay street legal. I didn't notice those on the build page.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I watched the video. It would be nice if Kawasaki offered turn signals and a horn to help it stay street legal. I didn't notice those on the build page.
None of the manufacturers want to go anywhere near insinuating they are suitable for street use, which they are not. Too much liability.
 

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That's really a shame because OHV's are such a huge part of Moab's economy. However, I have seen for myself all the idiots in their side x sides tearing around on the streets. I think a better option would be to just not allow atv's and utv's to run on the streets, at least not within the city limits. Problem solved and very little impact on the town's economy. No need to cancel one of the biggest annual events for the town. The people of Moab had best be careful about what they wish for....
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
There is no doubt the azzhats are ruining it for everybody. The problem with not allowing them on the streets is what do you do if you go there with your SxS in your toy hauler? Unless you double tow you have no means to transport it to a trailhead.

I hope folks wake up, and show some respect to host towns, and the trails, or the SxS industry will be toast.
 

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Living near, and doing business in a very hi volume tourist area, I submit the following.

Tourists do indeed bring in lots of revenue. I constantly bring this fact up to family members who hate them.

But.....if you are a local resident you have to deal with the following during high tourist traffic times.

Traffic, what used to be a 5 minute drive across town max is now a 20+minute ordeal with trailers suddenly stopping in the middle of the road, after doing 15 mph to try and figure where they want to go. Lane changes by big RV rigs cutting off traffic as they suddenly decide Taco Bell is what they want (turn signals optional). Jaywalking into the dysfunctional traffic mess becomes a national sport as "cross walks are for chump locals and I need to get in line at Subway now!" Militant mountain bikers who think pedal power has supreme traffic rights no matter what.

Gas stations are clogged with 40' RVs causing long waits as every kid is inside in line at the big gulp dispenser while the rig sits after being fueled for an extra 10 minutes.

Supermarkets. Well who doesnt like waiting to go down an isle as several families clog it up while arguing with 10 kids over the weeks meal plan and what brand of salsa is best for all? Hey let's have a group discussion and a vote. As a local your just supposed to smile an wait as there is zero concern for your time.

I can't tell you how many times I've seen rigs and trailers with multiple UTVS/ATVs callously parked in front of the engine bay ramps leading to the street of our fire department. Or in the firefighter parking where a rig will take up 10 firefighters parking spaces while "just doing a quick errand, what's the big deal? We spend a lot of money here " Of course blocking residential drives are fair game too, because there isn't good parking in this crappy town.

This group behaviour , by (all ) tourists is very stressful on locals and they do undeed vote and bitch to their elected leaders. Ironically, most locals moved to a nice, once quiet area (often at a reduced income) to get away from the behavior that seems to have followed them. I won't get into the absolutely militant powersports haters who leverage this behavior to their advantage. I kinda got in trouble on another board for bringing up that reality.

Add loud UTVs/bikes/ATVs buzzing around on local trails making a lot of dust, hauling ass on public roads for icing on the cake. I've had more than a few discussions with riders about why to you have to run full throttle through a residential subdivision with open pipes when just a mile down the road you have a million fricken acres to do it on where no one cares? NO ONE CARES, OR WANTS TO SEE WHAT YOUR WARP CAPABLE UTV CAN DO, THERE'S A MILLION OTHERS JUST LIKE IT. Powersport tends to reap the collective local wrath beuause we are noticeable and get blamed for the actions of all the tourists.

Sadly, we are our own worst enemy. 😟
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Living near, and doing business in a very hi volume tourist area, I submit the following.

Tourists do indeed bring in lots of revenue. I constantly bring this fact up to family members who hate them.

But.....if you are a local resident you have to deal with the following during high tourist traffic times.

Traffic, what used to be a 5 minute drive across town max is now a 20+minute ordeal with trailers suddenly stopping in the middle of the road, after doing 15 mph to try and figure where they want to go. Lane changes by big RV rigs cutting off traffic as they suddenly decide Taco Bell is what they want (turn signals optional). Jaywalking into the dysfunctional traffic mess becomes a national sport as "cross walks are for chump locals and I need to get in line at Subway now!" Militant mountain bikers who think pedal power has supreme traffic rights no matter what.

Gas stations are clogged with 40' RVs causing long waits as every kid is inside in line at the big gulp dispenser while the rig sits after being fueled for an extra 10 minutes.

Supermarkets. Well who doesnt like waiting to go down an isle as several families clog it up while arguing with 10 kids over the weeks meal plan and what brand of salsa is best for all? Hey let's have a group discussion and a vote. As a local your just supposed to smile an wait as there is zero concern for your time.

I can't tell you how many times I've seen rigs and trailers with multiple UTVS/ATVs callously parked in front of the engine bay ramps leading to the street of our fire department. Or in the firefighter parking where a rig will take up 10 firefighters parking spaces while "just doing a quick errand, what's the big deal? We spend a lot of money here " Of course blocking residential drives are fair game too, because there isn't good parking in this crappy town.

This group behaviour , by (all ) tourists is very stressful on locals and they do undeed vote and bitch to their elected leaders. Ironically, most locals moved to a nice, once quiet area (often at a reduced income) to get away from the behavior that seems to have followed them. I won't get into the absolutely militant powersports haters who leverage this behavior to their advantage. I kinda got in trouble on another board for bringing up that reality.

Add loud UTVs/bikes/ATVs buzzing around on local trails making a lot of dust, hauling ass on public roads for icing on the cake. I've had more than a few discussions with riders about why to you have to run full throttle through a residential subdivision with open pipes when just a mile down the road you have a million fricken acres to do it on where no one cares? NO ONE CARES, OR WANTS TO SEE WHAT YOUR WARP CAPABLE UTV CAN DO, THERE'S A MILLION OTHERS JUST LIKE IT. Powersport tends to reap the collective local wrath beuause we are noticeable and get blamed for the actions of all the tourists.

Sadly, we are our own worst enemy. 😟
I see all of the same locally. Certainly some with off roaders, but to a much larger degree with team ropers, who have taken over the town, and with the blessing of the town fathers. They can do no wrong. There is never a letter to the editor about the team roper who parks his 43 foot LQ horse trailer, which they NEVER EVER disconnect, broadside in front of the post office, blocking all of the handicap spots. A friend of mine's wife was at a local office, and came out to find her car blocked in by a roper double parked on a narrow downtown street. She has arthritis bad, and had to walk around to the driver's door to ask him to let her out. He said, "We'll be done in a bit", and rolled up his window. There she sat. This happens daily. I absolutely make no excuses for the SxS bad actors, but there have been countless letters, and several large, by local standards, articles about the evil off roaders. Nothing about the rope-a-dopers. The double standard is just utterly amazing.
 

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see all of the same locally. Certainly some with off roaders, but to a much larger degree with team ropers, who have taken over the town, and with the blessing of the town fathers. They can do no wrong. There is never a letter to the editor about the team roper who parks his 43 foot LQ horse trailer, which they NEVER EVER disconnect, broadside in front of the post office, blocking all of the handicap spots. A friend of mine's wife was at a local office, and came out to find her car blocked in by a roper double parked on a narrow downtown street. She has arthritis bad, and had to walk around to the driver's door to ask him to let her out. He said, "We'll be done in a bit", and rolled up his window.
LOL forgot about the rodeo crowd. Same deal in our A/O....and I got family into this big time. Ride the Rockies road bike Event..............clear the streets and no parking! State Patrol escorts and tickets for drivers who get impatient. Certain use groups are more equal than others.

Powersports are low hanging fruit for locals. Fact. When a Bike, UTV, ATV, blasts past my place at 50-60+ on my single lane dirt road, I can't help but think where are my dogs? stock? or I'm glad the grandkids are not out on their ATVs, or bikes today. Than It's, wow:) that was a bad A$$ ride.
 

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There is no doubt the azzhats are ruining it for everybody. The problem with not allowing them on the streets is what do you do if you go there with your SxS in your toy hauler? Unless you double tow you have no means to transport it to a trailhead.

I hope folks wake up, and show some respect to host towns, and the trails, or the SxS industry will be toast.
The same thing we do here in Colorado, where OHV's are NOT allowed on our streets/roads. You either figure it out (stay in a tent, cabin, hotel room, condo), or stay home, or camp somewhere you can ride out of camp. I have done all of the above except for the hotel room in my many Moab trips. You don't "have to" be able to ride on the streets.

This is how I deal with it now.

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Living near, and doing business in a very hi volume tourist area, I submit the following.

Tourists do indeed bring in lots of revenue. I constantly bring this fact up to family members who hate them.

But.....if you are a local resident you have to deal with the following during high tourist traffic times.

Traffic, what used to be a 5 minute drive across town max is now a 20+minute ordeal with trailers suddenly stopping in the middle of the road, after doing 15 mph to try and figure where they want to go.

Sadly, we are our own worst enemy. 😟
LOL I was hoping for only a 20 minute ordeal my last trip out. With the construction on the north end you could take a 20 minute nap before getting to the first signal light in town. :LOL:

Traffic is just part of living in a tourist type community. No way around it and tourists are the lifeblood of many towns such as Moab. It is just unfortunate that people think they need to rod their toys around town. It's also unfortunate that many locals do the same, then stand up and blame it all on those from out of town. I've come to the conclusion that people just suck! :sneaky: Our world is changing, and not for the better...
 

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This reminds me of Cape Cod back in the 90’s. It was the place to go during the summer months. College kids would rent houses for the summer, and party it up. They would spend a ton of money in the local economy, and also pick up jobs to help keep beer money in pocket. Sadly over time, the locals complained that it was ruining their “quaint New England towns” and they slowly started to clamp down on the party goers.
Fast forward to 2000, and it’s all gone. No more bars or clubs, no more college kids, no more revenue for the small towns. Now it’s just a place for people from the main land to have a summer home at ludicrous prices and local taxes.
The college kids? Oh they moved the party over to Newport RI, a place that welcomed them with open arms!!
 

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Planning a trip to Moab from Colorado this winter has really opened my eyes to the hostility in some areas. Potential vehicle impoundment for not following the letter of the law is pretty much a we hate you move in my eyes. I don't want to be where I'm not wanted.

The short answer is, I guess, to get more involved at the local level with advocacy groups. We have some pretty good folks in our area doing just that (no I'm not involved...yet). That said, our family and business has over the years given back a lot to the community. Give back is part of the rural equation. Our family community support is not specifically in UTV and trail areas, but it has been noticed even though we seldom talk about it.

It would be very cool if the manufacturer's would put money (trail grants) or PR efforts into local groups and help organize more publicized "good will" events to raise public awareness that there are indeed a lot of White Hat riders out there. White Hats way outnumber the dirt bag riders that seem to get the attention. Stuff like money raising poker runs/rallies, mentoring troubled youths by spending an afternoon on a ride to show them there is a an escape, or way out of the daily pain they deal with.

This isn't about just riding on the street. It is about loosing or keeping riding areas in the long run. Imagine if Kawasaki (or any manufacturer) , had a networked board or site where you call into and connect to, and get in touch with a local organization and just be able to "do something good" for the local community as part of your riding experience. UTV riders need to be perceived as givers rather than takers. Over the years, my wife and I have made it a habit to cruise the local trails every spring and pick up winter trash. Not a big deal, not even worth talking about we thought as we pretty much hate virtue signaling types. Perhaps we should start blowing our horns a bit as the squeaky wheel does get the grease.

Enough of the wishful thinking for now.
 

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The UTV's themselves are now a big part of the issue. It used to take years of building a machine capable of running these trails, or years of riding to get to level that you where comfortable getting off the beating path and knowing someone with experience to show you the trails once they thought you and your rig were ready. The idiots got left behind. Now anyone can finance a machine that is very capable and requires little skill to run trails they have clue about, into areas they can not take care of themselves in if they have an issue. Maps can be downloaded on your phone on the way to the place if your machine didn't come them already installed in a nav system on the dash. No more running with a group for a few runs before they will take you to their secret spot. A build now is bolting on a lightbar, whips and stereo and some new tires. Maybe if your "hardcore" a harness and have someone build you a cage. If you posted that as build 20 years ago you would still have emotional trauma from the verbal beating you would have received.
 

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The UTV's themselves are now a big part of the issue. It used to take years of building a machine capable of running these trails, or years of riding to get to level that you where comfortable getting off the beating path
Very well taken point. Riders have much less sweat in their machines nowadays. The UTV community needs to deal with this dynamic change in order to thrive. No easy answers other than mentoring and education I guess.

Sadly the small circle of very experienced hands I ride with totally avoid some of our best riding areas during busy season because of hi performance UTV drivers that they consider dangerous. Probably what they shouldn't be doing, but I can't blame them. They have done more than a few crash rescues in their careers.
 

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A little dated but gives a good read on the local politics.


Meanwhile, Reddish believes UTV businesses in Grand County should be concerned about the commission’s recent moves to reduce speed limits for OHVs and place a moratorium on licenses for new UTV businesses as well as UTV events.

Rally on the Rocks has a history of donating thousands of dollars to local organizations, including the gift of a custom Polaris RZR to the Grand County Search and Rescue team in 2016.

Reddish said organizers plan to instead donate $20,000 in 2021 to the San Juan County SAR team and the San Juan County Foundation, a Blanding-based nonprofit devoted to promoting education.



A lot of local hostility described in that news article.
 

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I see all of the same locally. Certainly some with off roaders, but to a much larger degree with team ropers, who have taken over the town, and with the blessing of the town fathers. They can do no wrong. There is never a letter to the editor about the team roper who parks his 43 foot LQ horse trailer, which they NEVER EVER disconnect, broadside in front of the post office, blocking all of the handicap spots. A friend of mine's wife was at a local office, and came out to find her car blocked in by a roper double parked on a narrow downtown street. She has arthritis bad, and had to walk around to the driver's door to ask him to let her out. He said, "We'll be done in a bit", and rolled up his window. There she sat. This happens daily. I absolutely make no excuses for the SxS bad actors, but there have been countless letters, and several large, by local standards, articles about the evil off roaders. Nothing about the rope-a-dopers. The double standard is just utterly amazing
LOL.....I just shared this with my wife...She went off on a rant and described her experiences at our local PO which are exactly as you describe to the last detail.
 

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UTV's are the new sit down watercraft. When "Jet Ski's" were stand ups and a challenge to ride, there were few problems and conflicts as it took some skill and experience to operate them. With sit down water craft, anyone can hop on and go 50+ mph...no skill or common sense required! Resulting in restrictions and closures. These are likely in OUR future too!

Manufacturers build products to sell and make money for share holders. Sometimes, they will help support events where their products are used. But seldom do they get involved in politics surrounding events and locations where their products are used.

Why not? First, most UTV manufactures are foreign owned companies, and reluctant to get involved in these types of issues. Second, UTV's are a very small part of their business. Honda sells hundreds of cars for every SXS. Kawasaki Heavy Industries build huge ships and earth moving equipment, CanAm parent builds planes and a lot of other products. Exceptions are Polaris and ArticCat, but I suspect similar thinking on these issues.

I am the co-founder of the second largest motorcycle racing series in US - AMA National Championship Grand Prix Series/Big 6 GP Series, and have been organizing races for over 40 years. In my experience, races and many organized events are not the problems. It's the weekend warrior who rolls into an area and wants to have a good time... Reading rules is not high on their priority list!

But, many organizers are into the sport for the money, and to them, it all comes down to money! More entries is better, as it means more dollars in their pocket.

The NCGPS/Big 6 are non-profit organizations where no one gets paid. Most events like ROTR are organized to make money, and money can color many decisions by organizers and participants. More entries mean more profit, but also more crowds and many times, more conflicts.

Many of the popular areas we recreate in, are also popular with people who don't like HATE what we do. And this conflict is growing as more people move to areas like Moab. I think, we can expect more issues and restrictions in the future.

WE can help by not doing DUMB things ourselves - see examples in posts above! This will help, but most enthusiasts are not the problem...
 
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